Is this why Eko wasn't sorry for what he did?

[J***@webtv.net]

MICHAEL: I hear you're a priest.

EKO: Yes.

MICHAEL: I guess you believe in hell, then.

EKO [helping Michael clean the blood]: For a brief time I served in a
small parish in England. Every Sunday after Mass, I would see a young
boy waiting in the back of the church. And then one day, the boy
confessed to me that he had beaten his dog to death with a shovel. He
said that the dog had bitten his baby sister on the cheek; and he needed
to protect her. And he wanted to know whether he would go to hell for
this. I told him that God would understand -- that he would be forgiven,
as long as he was sorry. But the boy did not care about forgiveness. He
was only afraid that if he did go to hell -- that dog would be there
waiting for him.

[Goetia]

Post by J***@webtv.net
MICHAEL: I hear you're a priest.
EKO: Yes.
MICHAEL: I guess you believe in hell, then.
EKO [helping Michael clean the blood]: For a brief time I served in a
small parish in England. Every Sunday after Mass, I would see a young
boy waiting in the back of the church. And then one day, the boy
confessed to me that he had beaten his dog to death with a shovel. He
said that the dog had bitten his baby sister on the cheek; and he needed
to protect her. And he wanted to know whether he would go to hell for
this. I told him that God would understand -- that he would be forgiven,
as long as he was sorry. But the boy did not care about forgiveness. He
was only afraid that if he did go to hell -- that dog would be there
waiting for him.

...

It's not that Eko wasn't sorry for what he did; he didn't believe he did
anything wrong. It's possible to know you did something wrong and not be
sorry, then you are in trouble (according to the Judeo/Christian tradition)
and could be hellbound, but Eko truly believed that he did nothing wrong, so
he was not going to ask for forgiveness.

I think that the reason for the off-island flashbacks was two-fold, to give
us background on Eko and to show what he did that the "entity" wanted him to
confess. In Eko's mind, off-island he did nothing wrong as he only killed
evil men out of necessity, so he was not going to confess for something that
he felt was not a sin. This was shown in the flashback when the sister was
forcing Eko to confess for something that he felt was not sinful. Had he
confessed, he would have been a hypocrite to himself as its just words that
have no place in his heart.

Now on the island, he did, in his mind, commit sin. When he killed the two
Others. He took steps to make amends for that by remaining silent for forty
days and asking for forgiveness from Henry. I think he did this when he
believed that The Others are good people, so it was wrong for him to have
harmed them.

Whether or not Eko is a good man, a holy man, a shaman, etc. is open to
debate, but its very apparent that he is a man of integrity and it was
because of this integrity that he could not be something he is not and so he
did not confess.

Blessed Be Dear Eko ^_^

[J***@webtv.net]

Post by Goetia
Whether or not Eko is a good man, a holy
man, a shaman, etc. is open to debate, but its
very apparent that he is a man of integrity and
it was because of this integrity that he could
not be something he is not and so he did not
confess.

He may have considered himself a man of integrity, but we saw him for
what he really was, a murderous, drug dealer war-lord, who used the act
of saving his Brother as an excuse to justify his lifestyle.

..OJ. also believed in his heart that he didn't kill his wife and
Goldman, but that doesn't alter the fact that he did. ...If he was to
meet his maker, and say: "I didn't do it... Even the courts found me
innocent", would be be forgiven?

Evidently, Eko found out the boy had a reason to be afraid... If you
don't accept responsibility for your life, you have to be prepared to
pay the price. ..In Eko's case, he discovered the dog was indeed,
waiting for him. ...Jon

[p0id0g]

I want you to know that i am <em>trying</em> to walk a righteous
path.....

[J***@webtv.net]

Post by p0id0g
I want you to know that i am <em>trying</em>
to walk a righteous path.....

Yes, there are two paths you can go by, but in the long run, there's
still time to change the road you're on. Stairway to Heaven-- Led
Zepplin

[w***@btinternet.com]

Post by J***@webtv.net

Post by p0id0g
I want you to know that i am <em>trying</em>
to walk a righteous path.....

Yes, there are two paths you can go by, but in the long run, there's
still time to change the road you're on. Stairway to Heaven-- Led
Zepplin

Or you you could just do nothing.......Religion is a big lie you know?

[PuddinTame]

Post by w***@btinternet.com
Or you you could just do nothing.......Religion is a big lie you know?

Shh..don't give the game away, brother.

[mpc]

I found it interesting when Mr.Eko told the form of his brother that he
had nothing to confess, and that he was NOT repentant for the things he
did, Yemi led Mr. Eko to the forest where the smoke monster attacked
and killed him. If the form of Yemi was the smoke monster, wouldn't
he/it just attack him right there and then, instead of running away
into the forest, then attack him? Naw, the smoke monster is the
"heavy." It does the dirty deeds.

Then there is the form of Yemi... was it Mr. Eko's imagination? A
delusion? Or a real manifestation of ...something? Why did it want Mr.
Eko to confess to it? Did it imagine itself to be a god? Was it looking
for a messenger, a prophet... a replacement? Maybe Ben was in Mr. Eko's
place at one time and did confess and profess his devotion to it, and
was thus "saved" and put in charge. A good replacement for Ben would
probably have been Mr. Eko... he tries to be good, but when push comes
to shove, Mr. Eko could bring on the wrath! But Mr. Eko was judged to
be unworthy by not confessing to the image of his brother, Yemi, and
thus not worshiping the image. Made it mad. "You talk to me as if I am
your brother." Maybe the unsaid part was, "I am a god."

When Ben was found to have a life-threatening tumor on his spine and
needed a surgeon, did the island find one at 40,000 feet? Could the
island have been bringing Oceanic flight 815 (and, Jack) to the island
to fix Ben, but was thwarted by the accidental discharge of
electromagnetic energy caused by Desmond NOT pushing the button? And
thus breaking up the plane. In season 1, it was an image of Jack's
father that led the Losties to the much needed water...just in time to
save them (and Jack).

-mike

[PuddinTame]

Post by mpc
Did it imagine itself to be a god? Was it looking
for a messenger, a prophet... a replacement? Maybe Ben was in Mr. Eko's
place at one time and did confess and profess his devotion to it, and
was thus "saved" and put in charge.

It is OZ, the great and powerful.

(Pay no attention to the one-eyed man behind the curtain)

[Goetia]

Post by w***@btinternet.com

Post by J***@webtv.net

Post by p0id0g
I want you to know that i am <em>trying</em>
to walk a righteous path.....

Yes, there are two paths you can go by, but in the long run, there's
still time to change the road you're on. Stairway to Heaven-- Led
Zepplin

Or you you could just do nothing.......Religion is a big lie you know?

Life is a big lie, my proof? You die, so everything you do vanishes *poof*

[PuddinTame]

Post by Goetia
Life is a big lie, my proof? You die, so everything you do vanishes *poof*

Not true. They say that you lose control of your bowels. *poo*

[Jack Locke]

Post by Goetia

Post by w***@btinternet.com

Post by J***@webtv.net

Post by p0id0g
I want you to know that i am <em>trying</em>
to walk a righteous path.....

Yes, there are two paths you can go by, but in the long run, there's
still time to change the road you're on. Stairway to Heaven-- Led
Zepplin

Or you you could just do nothing.......Religion is a big lie you know?

Life is a big lie, my proof? You die, so everything you do vanishes *poof*

Hitler died. Did everything he did vanish with him?

[Goetia]

Post by Jack Locke

Post by Goetia

Post by w***@btinternet.com

Post by J***@webtv.net

Post by p0id0g
I want you to know that i am <em>trying</em>
to walk a righteous path.....

Yes, there are two paths you can go by, but in the long run, there's
still time to change the road you're on. Stairway to Heaven-- Led
Zepplin

Or you you could just do nothing.......Religion is a big lie you know?

Life is a big lie, my proof? You die, so everything you do vanishes *poof*

Hitler died. Did everything he did vanish with him?

...

From Hilter's point of view? Yes.

[Goetia]

Post by J***@webtv.net

Post by Goetia
Whether or not Eko is a good man, a holy
man, a shaman, etc. is open to debate, but its
very apparent that he is a man of integrity and
it was because of this integrity that he could
not be something he is not and so he did not
confess.

He may have considered himself a man of integrity, but we saw him for
what he really was, a murderous, drug dealer war-lord, who used the act
of saving his Brother as an excuse to justify his lifestyle.
..OJ. also believed in his heart that he didn't kill his wife and
Goldman, but that doesn't alter the fact that he did. ...If he was to
meet his maker, and say: "I didn't do it... Even the courts found me
innocent", would be be forgiven?

...

O.J. Was found not guilty of murder, as to whether or not he actually did it
and what he believed in his heart is unknown at this time.

Post by J***@webtv.net
Evidently, Eko found out the boy had a reason to be afraid... If you
don't accept responsibility for your life, you have to be prepared to
pay the price. ..In Eko's case, he discovered the dog was indeed,
waiting for him. ...Jon

All that is true, but that's not what your question asked. You are
essentially asking "What was going on with Eko that made him not want to
repent?".

What your response to my post was about, concerns external matters - what
the world (us) things about what he did.

[Goetia]

Post by Goetia
What your response to my post was about, concerns external matters - what
the world (us) things about what he did.

CORRECTION:

....the world (us) THINKS about what he did.

[Goetia]

Post by J***@webtv.net
Evidently, Eko found out the boy had a reason to be afraid... If you
don't accept responsibility for your life, you have to be prepared to
pay the price. ..In Eko's case, he discovered the dog was indeed,
waiting for him. ...Jon

You know, that's a good point, maybe its not so much the forgiveness of god
that is needed, but the forgiveness of the one you harm that truly matters.
If you take responsibility and make amends with the person harmed and they
forgive you, then god will do the same. Balance the Karma in a matter of
speaking.

[Goetia]

Post by Goetia

Post by J***@webtv.net
Evidently, Eko found out the boy had a reason to be afraid... If you
don't accept responsibility for your life, you have to be prepared to
pay the price. ..In Eko's case, he discovered the dog was indeed,
waiting for him. ...Jon

You know, that's a good point, maybe its not so much the forgiveness of
god that is needed, but the forgiveness of the one you harm that truly
matters. If you take responsibility and make amends with the person harmed
and they forgive you, then god will do the same. Balance the Karma in a
matter of speaking.

...

CORRECTION:

.....in a MANNER of speaking.



Its late and my fingers and brain are LOST ^_^

.......Goodnight

[PuddinTame]

Post by J***@webtv.net
He may have considered himself a man of integrity, but we saw him for
what he really was, a murderous, drug dealer war-lord, who used the act
of saving his Brother as an excuse to justify his lifestyle.

Did we ever see Eko kill an innocent person?

[J***@webtv.net]

Post by PuddinTame
Did we ever see Eko kill an innocent person?

It seemed to me there were very few people around him whom he didn't
kill.

...Vengeance is mine, sayeth the Lord... It's not Eko's place to apply
justice, when he is just as corrupt as the people he killed. ...Recall
the lame excuse he used for shipping the drugs out of the country.
.Jon

[PuddinTame]

Post by J***@webtv.net
It seemed to me there were very few people around him whom he didn't
kill.

He didn't kill the boy when he killed those two Morrocan drug dealers.

I submit he only killed people who were as bad or worse than he was.

Post by J***@webtv.net
...Vengeance is mine, sayeth the Lord... It's not Eko's place to apply
justice, when he is just as corrupt as the people he killed. ...Recall
the lame excuse he used for shipping the drugs out of the country.

I guess it comes down to how you feel about the opening scene of "Cost
of Living"

Do you consider it a sin for Eko to steal to feed his brother?

[J***@webtv.net]

Post by PuddinTame
He didn't kill the boy when he killed those two
Morrocan drug dealers.

Wasn't that so the guy would take the message back?

Post by PuddinTame
I submit he only killed people who were as
bad or worse than he was.

And that makes it right ??

Post by PuddinTame
Do you consider it a sin for Eko to steal to
feed his brother?

I remember I got into a huge debate on another group, with these
"reightious/Church going" individuals, who believed that it was
justified for the people to "steal" supplies from this grocery store (as
what we saw on the news), after the hurricane struck in New Orleans.

I feel the same way about what happened there, as with Eko stealing to
feed his Brother. ...It isn't justifed; there are alternatives.
..Jon

[PuddinTame]

Post by J***@webtv.net

Post by PuddinTame
I submit he only killed people who were as
bad or worse than he was.

And that makes it right ??

It makes it less wrong.

Post by J***@webtv.net

Post by PuddinTame
Do you consider it a sin for Eko to steal to
feed his brother?

I remember I got into a huge debate on another group, with these
"reightious/Church going" individuals, who believed that it was
justified for the people to "steal" supplies from this grocery store (as
what we saw on the news), after the hurricane struck in New Orleans.
I feel the same way about what happened there, as with Eko stealing to
feed his Brother. ...It isn't justifed; there are alternatives.

...

Wow.
I hope you never have to find out for yourself.

[J***@webtv.net]

Post by PuddinTame
It makes it less wrong.

Did you ever stop to think that maybe the people whom Eko killed were
only trying to survive too... ? Perhaps they started out the same way
he did.

...The buck has to stop somewhere. ...Someone has to be accountable...

Post by PuddinTame
Wow.
I hope you never have to find out for yourself.

Unbelievable !! No wonder there is so much crime in the world
today.... ...Jon

[PuddinTame]

Post by J***@webtv.net
Did you ever stop to think that maybe the people whom Eko killed were
only trying to survive too... ? Perhaps they started out the same way
he did.

It's a cruel world. Especially in some African countries. Dog eat
dog. Kill or be killed. What can I say? I've never had to lead a life
like that. I count myself lucky I was born a spoiled brat in the USA.
I hesitate to judge someone living in harsh circumstances where they
may not have the luxury of obeying the rules if they wish to keep their
family fed.

Post by J***@webtv.net
...The buck has to stop somewhere. ...Someone has to be accountable...

I hope each person could be judged by weighing their sins against their
acts of good.

Post by J***@webtv.net
Unbelievable !! No wonder there is so much crime in the world
today.... ...Jon

No wonder there is such intolerance.
A crime is a rule of man.
Breaking such a rule is not necessarily a sin in the grand scheme of
things. Sometimes following a rule blindly is a greater sin.
Everything should be judged in context.

And now, our closing hymn will be..."Yes! We Have No Bananas"

[J***@webtv.net]

Post by PuddinTame
No wonder there is such intolerance.
A crime is a rule of man.

Are you trying to be profound here?

Post by PuddinTame
Breaking such a rule is not necessarily a sin in
the grand scheme of things. Sometimes
following a rule blindly is a greater sin.
Everything should be judged in context.

Evidently Smokey didn't feel that way, when it came to Eko... To put it
a better way, you could say: Eko failed to see the "light". So
regardless of his attempt to justify his actions, he paid the price for
the life he led.

Post by PuddinTame
And now, our closing hymn will be..."Yes! We
Have No Bananas"

You're obviously trying to be funny here. ...Perhaps not realizing that
you hit the nail on the head with regards to the point I was trying to
get across. Yes! we may indeed have no bananas. ...But... We've
string beans, onions, cabbages, scallions... etc. There are
always options. Resorting to crime is not an option; it is an excuse.
..Jon

[PuddinTame]

Post by J***@webtv.net
Are you trying to be profound here?

I regard the topic under discussion as pretty profound, yes.

Post by J***@webtv.net
Evidently Smokey didn't feel that way, when it came to Eko... To put it
a better way, you could say: Eko failed to see the "light". So
regardless of his attempt to justify his actions, he paid the price for
the life he led.

Smokey is a bastard.

Post by J***@webtv.net
You're obviously trying to be funny here. ...Perhaps not realizing that
you hit the nail on the head with regards to the point I was trying to
get across. Yes! we may indeed have no bananas. ...But... We've
string beans, onions, cabbages, scallions... etc. There are
always options. Resorting to crime is not an option; it is an excuse.
..Jon

People steal to feed their family because sometime there is no other
option. A control freak like you would never be able to understand
that.
Now return to the comfort of your livingroom, eat your microwave
popcorn, watch your DVDs and gloat about how you are so much better
than those lowly Katrina victims who didn't resort to other "options."

[Richard DeLuca]

Post by PuddinTame

Post by J***@webtv.net
Are you trying to be profound here?

I regard the topic under discussion as pretty profound, yes.

Post by J***@webtv.net
Evidently Smokey didn't feel that way, when it came to Eko... To put it
a better way, you could say: Eko failed to see the "light". So
regardless of his attempt to justify his actions, he paid the price for
the life he led.

Smokey is a bastard.

Post by J***@webtv.net
You're obviously trying to be funny here. ...Perhaps not realizing that
you hit the nail on the head with regards to the point I was trying to
get across. Yes! we may indeed have no bananas. ...But... We've
string beans, onions, cabbages, scallions... etc. There are
always options. Resorting to crime is not an option; it is an excuse.
..Jon

People steal to feed their family because sometime there is no other
option. A control freak like you would never be able to understand
that.
Now return to the comfort of your livingroom, eat your microwave
popcorn, watch your DVDs and gloat about how you are so much better
than those lowly Katrina victims who didn't resort to other "options."

...

I'm coming in here late, so I'll apologize right here up front if I've
misjudged the content of your remarks. It seems to me that the
majority of the looters I saw on TV in New Orleans were just that,
looters. Food wasn't being stolen; it was mostly electronics and
sneakers.

Having said that, I agree with you that to feed my family I would steal
if there were no other options. And I wouldn't worry about any heavenly
redemption. I would however try to repay the debt.

[J***@webtv.net]

Post by Richard DeLuca
Having said that, I agree with you that to feed
my family I would steal if there were no other
options. And I wouldn't worry about any
heavenly redemption. I would however try to
repay the debt.

Ahh... Someone gets my point. "I would, however, try to repay the
debt." ...You borrowed. ....Big difference. ...In your heart, you are
aware that the goods in the store are not yours for the taking, simply
because you've hit on hard times.

The ones I'm referring to, are those that hold the opinion that just
because a crisis hits, it is their God-given right to break the law--

Anarchy... All the moral values that those in the community spent
their lifetime building, get instantly chucked. ...Jon

[r***@bestweb.net]

Post by Richard DeLuca
It seems to me that the
majority of the looters I saw on TV in New Orleans were just that,
looters. Food wasn't being stolen; it was mostly electronics and
sneakers.

If they hadn't taken it, it would probably either have gone to waste or
been taken by someone else.

[J***@webtv.net]

Post by PuddinTame
I regard the topic under discussion as pretty
profound, yes.

I didn't say anything about topic

Post by PuddinTame
Smokey is a bastard.

Why? ...'Cause he eliminated a killer?

Post by PuddinTame
People steal to feed their family because
sometime there is no other option. A control
freak like you would never be able to
understand that.
Now return to the comfort of your livingroom,
eat your microwave popcorn, watch your
DVDs and gloat about how you are so much
better than those lowly Katrina victims who
didn't resort to other "options."

Spewing smart-ass remarks does little to bolster your point of view.
... Be sure to frame your paragraph above. Then if someone busts into
your house and robs you blind, you'll know what it feels like to be on
the other end of the stick. ...Jon

[PuddinTame]

Post by J***@webtv.net
I didn't say anything about topic

You were talking about my remarks..which were about the topic...let's
just agree on the you "didn't say anything" part

Post by J***@webtv.net
Spewing smart-ass remarks does little to bolster your point of view.

Oh i think they help my argument along quite nicely. :)
Better than your I'm-Better-Than-Those-Katrina-Lowlifes remarks

Post by J***@webtv.net
... Be sure to frame your paragraph above.

Oh but there is a gold border. Don't you see it?

Post by J***@webtv.net
Then if someone busts into
your house and robs you blind, you'll know what it feels like to be on
the other end of the stick.

There's a difference between stealing bread and stealing a stereo.
I know.
Not to you.

[Goetia]

Post by J***@webtv.net

Post by PuddinTame
He didn't kill the boy when he killed those two
Morrocan drug dealers.

Wasn't that so the guy would take the message back?

Post by PuddinTame
I submit he only killed people who were as
bad or worse than he was.

And that makes it right ??

Post by PuddinTame
Do you consider it a sin for Eko to steal to
feed his brother?

I remember I got into a huge debate on another group, with these
"reightious/Church going" individuals, who believed that it was
justified for the people to "steal" supplies from this grocery store (as
what we saw on the news), after the hurricane struck in New Orleans.
I feel the same way about what happened there, as with Eko stealing to
feed his Brother. ...It isn't justifed; there are alternatives.
..Jon

...

Didn't king David eat the sacred bread, which is considered a sin, because
he was hungry? I seem to recall that Yeshua (Jesus) had no trouble with
this. Seems Eko did something quite similar.

[PuddinTame]

Post by Goetia
Didn't king David eat the sacred bread, which is considered a sin, because
he was hungry? I seem to recall that Yeshua (Jesus) had no trouble with
this. Seems Eko did something quite similar.

You're trying to get through to a self-righteous knucklehead who
probably thinks the Katrina victims chose their own fate and got what
they deserved (Yes! There are such "people" out there (shivers).).
You're wasting your time. Stealing only becomes right for someone like
that when *theirs* is the family who is starving. And then it's
*their* turn to be condemned by their judgmental brethren. Oh, sweet
irony! :-D

[Goetia]

Post by PuddinTame

Post by Goetia
Didn't king David eat the sacred bread, which is considered a sin, because
he was hungry? I seem to recall that Yeshua (Jesus) had no trouble with
this. Seems Eko did something quite similar.

You're trying to get through to a self-righteous knucklehead who
probably thinks the Katrina victims chose their own fate and got what
they deserved (Yes! There are such "people" out there (shivers).).
You're wasting your time. Stealing only becomes right for someone like
that when *theirs* is the family who is starving. And then it's
*their* turn to be condemned by their judgmental brethren. Oh, sweet
irony! :-D

...

Yeah I know, but I had to put my 2 cents in. (^)_(^) Although I think my
statement about king David is worth considerably more. *grin*

[Goetia]

Post by Goetia

Post by PuddinTame

Post by Goetia
Didn't king David eat the sacred bread, which is considered a sin, because
he was hungry? I seem to recall that Yeshua (Jesus) had no trouble with
this. Seems Eko did something quite similar.

You're trying to get through to a self-righteous knucklehead who
probably thinks the Katrina victims chose their own fate and got what
they deserved (Yes! There are such "people" out there (shivers).).
You're wasting your time. Stealing only becomes right for someone like
that when *theirs* is the family who is starving. And then it's
*their* turn to be condemned by their judgmental brethren. Oh, sweet
irony! :-D

Yeah I know, but I had to put my 2 cents in. (^)_(^) Although I think my
statement about king David is worth considerably more. *grin*

...

As a matter of fact, the Torah states that it is ok for a passerby who is
hungry to eat his fill of any farmland he/she finds along the way and this
is not considered stealing. Only if you take any with you like in a basket
or what not is it considered stealing. Also the farm owner is to leave a the
outer ring of the land unharvested for the animals to eat from. Yeshua
(Jesus) never changed this law so it is still in affect.

And again, Yeshua (Jesus) and his disciples were rubbing the grains of wheat
on the Sabbath and eating and the Pharisees got upset that he did that on
the Sabbath. Now what he and his disciples were doing had to have been on
someone's farmland as it says field of grain.

So Yeshua (Jesus) himself did what Eko did. He fed his "brothers".

Blessed Be.

[J***@webtv.net]

Post by PuddinTame
You're trying to get through to a self-righteous
knucklehead who probably thinks the Katrina
victims chose their own fate and got what
they deserved (Yes! There are such "people"
out there (shivers).). You're wasting your time.
Stealing only becomes right for someone like
that when *theirs* is the family who is
starving. And then it's *their* turn to be
condemned by their judgmental brethren. Oh,
sweet irony! :-D

So now you're relying on your own selfish thoughts, thinking they apply
to what I said??
...Let me guess... If you and your mate were stranded on a deserted
island, you would think it your right to kill this person, because --
after all-- you were hungry, and you know this person had a snack in
their pocket.

..Why don't you try to looking at both sides of the story, before you
start spewing off. ...Jon

[r***@bestweb.net]

Post by J***@webtv.net
...Let me guess... If you and your mate were stranded on a deserted
island, you would think it your right to kill this person, because --
after all-- you were hungry, and you know this person had a snack in
their pocket.

And you think that's NOT right?

[Stick Waver]

Post by r***@bestweb.net

Post by J***@webtv.net
...Let me guess... If you and your mate were stranded on a deserted
island, you would think it your right to kill this person, because --
after all-- you were hungry, and you know this person had a snack in
their pocket.

And you think that's NOT right?

Of course it's not. WTF??

[r***@bestweb.net]

Post by Stick Waver

Post by r***@bestweb.net

Post by J***@webtv.net
...Let me guess... If you and your mate were stranded on a deserted
island, you would think it your right to kill this person, because --
after all-- you were hungry, and you know this person had a snack in
their pocket.

And you think that's NOT right?

Of course it's not. WTF??

If someone is going to die anyway (And if not, why pose the question
that way?), why should not each person try to take action to make sure
it's the other guy, not hirself?

[Gourbi]

Post by PuddinTame

Post by J***@webtv.net
He may have considered himself a man of integrity, but we saw him for
what he really was, a murderous, drug dealer war-lord, who used the act
of saving his Brother as an excuse to justify his lifestyle.

Did we ever see Eko kill an innocent person?

What about the priest he killed to prevent his brother to do it?

[PuddinTame]

Post by Gourbi
What about the priest he killed to prevent his brother to do it?

Okay, well there ya got me.

I don't think it was a priest. I think it was just an old man.

[Gourbi]

Post by PuddinTame

Post by Gourbi
What about the priest he killed to prevent his brother to do it?

Okay, well there ya got me.
I don't think it was a priest. I think it was just an old man.

And you probably got me on that one ;-)

[Stick Waver]

Post by PuddinTame

Post by Gourbi
What about the priest he killed to prevent his brother to do it?

Okay, well there ya got me.
I don't think it was a priest. I think it was just an old man.

"just?"

[Goetia]

Post by Stick Waver

Post by PuddinTame

Post by Gourbi
What about the priest he killed to prevent his brother to do it?

Okay, well there ya got me.
I don't think it was a priest. I think it was just an old man.

"just?"

In that situation SOMEONE was going to die no matter what Eko did. They are
just children placed in an impossible situation and we need to look at what
was in Eko's heart at that moment, he was trying to do what he thought was
best in that situation and if the god of the universe can't understand that
and throws something a child does in an impossible situation to hellfire,
then that's no god of mine.

Eko was the victim, why focus on him when we should be focused on the
fucking bastard that put him in that situation in the first place.

[J***@webtv.net]

Post by Goetia
Eko was the victim, why focus on him when
we should be focused on the fucking bastard
that put him in that situation in the first place.

You're missing the whole point. ...And even Yemi pointed it out to Eko.
That one act did not justify a lifetime of crime. ...Jon

[Goetia]

Post by J***@webtv.net

Post by Goetia
Eko was the victim, why focus on him when
we should be focused on the fucking bastard
that put him in that situation in the first place.

You're missing the whole point. ...And even Yemi pointed it out to Eko.
That one act did not justify a lifetime of crime. ...Jon

I'm not talking about his lifetime, just the moment when he was a child in
the situation the original poster of this sub-thread referred to.

As to his lifetime of crime, no question he did some very bad things, but I
still say he has a good heart. He was a good man on a very bad path and who
are we to judge.

[Gourbi]

Post by Goetia

Post by J***@webtv.net

Post by Goetia
Eko was the victim, why focus on him when
we should be focused on the fucking bastard
that put him in that situation in the first place.

You're missing the whole point. ...And even Yemi pointed it out to Eko.
That one act did not justify a lifetime of crime. ...Jon

I'm not talking about his lifetime, just the moment when he was a child in
the situation the original poster of this sub-thread referred to.

You're right that the focus should be put on those who brought Eko to
kill the old man (the priest?) in that particular moment.
But it remains a fact that the old man was an innocent victim.

Yet, I don't know what I would have done at Eko's place. Because I still
don't know what would have been right and what would have been wrong.

To bring it to a provocative extreme: why did he killed the old man and
didn't dare kill instead the one who ordered him to do so?

Post by Goetia
As to his lifetime of crime, no question he did some very bad things, but I
still say he has a good heart. He was a good man on a very bad path and who
are we to judge.

Well, fortunately, it's only a TV show, so we just judge on a
theoretical level and not for real.

I agree with you that Eko's personality is a very attractive one, and
that it's not difficult at all to excuse him by saying that "he was a
good man on a very bad path" and that "he has a good heart".
I like(d) very much the ambivalence of this character, and I will miss
the "real" Mr. Eko (i.e. the one played by Adewale Akinnuoye-Agbaje).

I feel sympathy for Mr.Eko--even knowing what he did as a warlord and
drug-dealer--but I can't say if it is right or wrong.

[r***@bestweb.net]

Post by Gourbi
To bring it to a provocative extreme: why did he killed the old man and
didn't dare kill instead the one who ordered him to do so?

Because then even more killing would've ensued in his village.
However, it would be fun to find out in another flashback that he had
something against the old man!

Reminds me of the time I got a free shove in against a cop. My father
had gotten into a little altercation in my presence with someone who
gave him a shove at the shoulders. Daddy called over a policeman to
complain. The policeman asked me what I saw the other person do. I
couldn't pass up the opportunity. I said, "He went like this." and I
shoved the cop, who was slight of build and wasn't expecting it, so he
staggered back a bit. Later my father couldn't believe me when I told
him I'd done it on purpose.

Robert

[Gourbi]

Post by r***@bestweb.net

Post by Gourbi
To bring it to a provocative extreme: why did he killed the old man and
didn't dare kill instead the one who ordered him to do so?

Because then even more killing would've ensued in his village.

Maybe, maybe not. If the leader of the gang would have been killed, the
rest of the gang might have been disoriented and the just fled...

Post by r***@bestweb.net
However, it would be fun to find out in another flashback that he had
something against the old man!

But then the focus wouldn't be anymore on him protecting his brother but
on him taking revenge.

Post by r***@bestweb.net
Reminds me of the time I got a free shove in against a cop. My father
had gotten into a little altercation in my presence with someone who
gave him a shove at the shoulders. Daddy called over a policeman to
complain. The policeman asked me what I saw the other person do. I
couldn't pass up the opportunity. I said, "He went like this." and I
shoved the cop, who was slight of build and wasn't expecting it, so he
staggered back a bit. Later my father couldn't believe me when I told
him I'd done it on purpose.
Robert

...

So, can we expect so see you on the Island, then?... ;-)

[Sean]

Post by Goetia
I'm not talking about his lifetime, just the moment when he was a child in
the situation the original poster of this sub-thread referred to.
As to his lifetime of crime, no question he did some very bad things, but I
still say he has a good heart. He was a good man on a very bad path and who
are we to judge.

And who or what is Smoky, to judge? Just because it has the ability to
elicit these responses from people, is that any reason to kill them?
And quite violently, too, I might add.

Slightly OT, is it possible that Smoky got Scott/Steve and it was
misperceived that Ethan did it? I really am asking for clarification
since I don't recall that episode well.

Sean

[Goetia]

Post by Sean

Post by Goetia
I'm not talking about his lifetime, just the moment when he was a child in
the situation the original poster of this sub-thread referred to.
As to his lifetime of crime, no question he did some very bad things, but I
still say he has a good heart. He was a good man on a very bad path and who
are we to judge.

And who or what is Smoky, to judge? Just because it has the ability to
elicit these responses from people, is that any reason to kill them?
And quite violently, too, I might add.
Slightly OT, is it possible that Smoky got Scott/Steve and it was
misperceived that Ethan did it? I really am asking for clarification
since I don't recall that episode well.
Sean

...

I think its very possible and as a matter of fact, it might very well be
considering the manner in which they were killed. I believe they were found
with broken bones like they were smashed up. Seems like the work of Smokey
to me.

[PuddinTame]

Post by Goetia
I think its very possible and as a matter of fact, it might very well be
considering the manner in which they were killed. I believe they were found
with broken bones like they were smashed up. Seems like the work of Smokey
to me.

You forget how noisey Smokey tends to be. Especially when he is in
"exterminate!" mode.
I think someone would have woken up or heard Steve/Scott/Whoever
screaming.

[Goetia]

Post by PuddinTame

Post by Goetia
I think its very possible and as a matter of fact, it might very well be
considering the manner in which they were killed. I believe they were found
with broken bones like they were smashed up. Seems like the work of Smokey
to me.

You forget how noisey Smokey tends to be. Especially when he is in
"exterminate!" mode.
I think someone would have woken up or heard Steve/Scott/Whoever
screaming.

Thats true, I forgot about that

[David B]

Post by Sean

Post by Goetia
I'm not talking about his lifetime, just the moment when he was a child in
the situation the original poster of this sub-thread referred to.
As to his lifetime of crime, no question he did some very bad things, but I
still say he has a good heart. He was a good man on a very bad path and who
are we to judge.

And who or what is Smoky, to judge? Just because it has the ability to
elicit these responses from people, is that any reason to kill them?
And quite violently, too, I might add.
Slightly OT, is it possible that Smoky got Scott/Steve and it was
misperceived that Ethan did it?

...

Doubtful. Scott was killed on the beach and so far there is no evidence that
Smoky goes near or onto the beach. Scott was killed just hours after Ethan
threaten to kill the Losties. Odds are very good it was him.

[PuddinTame]

Post by Sean
And who or what is Smoky, to judge?

I theorize Smokey is remote-controlled by a human. Maybe the guy with
the eyepatch. Whoever it is, he is "very unforgiving"

Post by Sean
Slightly OT, is it possible that Smoky got Scott/Steve and it was
misperceived that Ethan did it? I really am asking for clarification
since I don't recall that episode well.

Smokey tends to make a LITTLE bit of noise when he's angry.
He's about as subtle as a train wreck.
So, I doubt it.

[Stick Waver]

Post by Sean

Post by Goetia
I'm not talking about his lifetime, just the moment when he was a child in
the situation the original poster of this sub-thread referred to.
As to his lifetime of crime, no question he did some very bad things, but I
still say he has a good heart. He was a good man on a very bad path and who
are we to judge.

And who or what is Smoky, to judge?

Well, that is the $64,000 question!

Post by Sean
Just because it has the ability to
elicit these responses from people, is that any reason to kill them?
And quite violently, too, I might add.
Slightly OT, is it possible that Smoky got Scott/Steve and it was
misperceived that Ethan did it? I really am asking for clarification
since I don't recall that episode well.
Sean

[PuddinTame]

Post by Stick Waver
"just?"

Yes. "Just"
As in "simply an old man of no specific station/rank or title."

[r***@bestweb.net]

Post by PuddinTame
Did we ever see Eko kill an innocent person?

He slit 2 people's throats just for touching a raw nerve with him,
saying he had no soul.

[Goetia]

Post by r***@bestweb.net

Post by PuddinTame
Did we ever see Eko kill an innocent person?

He slit 2 people's throats just for touching a raw nerve with him,
saying he had no soul.

I see your point, but it is questionable as to whether druglords are
"innocent".

He murdered murderers.

[r***@bestweb.net]

Post by Goetia

Post by r***@bestweb.net

Post by PuddinTame
Did we ever see Eko kill an innocent person?

He slit 2 people's throats just for touching a raw nerve with him,
saying he had no soul.

I see your point, but it is questionable as to whether druglords are
"innocent".
He murdered murderers.

What evidence do you have that they were murderers?

[Goetia]

Post by r***@bestweb.net

Post by Goetia

Post by r***@bestweb.net

Post by PuddinTame
Did we ever see Eko kill an innocent person?

He slit 2 people's throats just for touching a raw nerve with him,
saying he had no soul.

I see your point, but it is questionable as to whether druglords are
"innocent".
He murdered murderers.

What evidence do you have that they were murderers?

Yeah yeah, I see your point *lol*

Ok then, scratch my second line (^_^)

[Stick Waver]

Post by Goetia

Post by r***@bestweb.net

Post by PuddinTame
Did we ever see Eko kill an innocent person?

He slit 2 people's throats just for touching a raw nerve with him,
saying he had no soul.

I see your point, but it is questionable as to whether druglords are
"innocent".
He murdered murderers.

He still murdered. And was unrepentent or remorseful. That will get
you to Hell and Smokey seems to have obliged.

[PuddinTame]

Post by r***@bestweb.net
He slit 2 people's throats just for touching a raw nerve with him,
saying he had no soul.

I doubt those Morrocan drug lords were too innocent. He did let the
boy live.

As someone else pointed out the only (apparently) innocent person he
killed was the old man he shot when he was a hboy. But it can be
argued- beyond the fact that he was justa child- taht he had little
choice if he wanted to save Yemi.

[Stick Waver]

Post by PuddinTame

Post by r***@bestweb.net
He slit 2 people's throats just for touching a raw nerve with him,
saying he had no soul.

I doubt those Morrocan drug lords were too innocent.

Doubt and 50 cents will buy you a cup of coffee ;-)

Post by PuddinTame
He did let the
boy live.

Oh, goodie for him; let's canonize him.

Post by PuddinTame
As someone else pointed out the only (apparently)

Apparently and 50 cents will get you another cup of coffee.

;-)

Post by PuddinTame
innocent person he
killed was the old man he shot when he was a hboy. But it can be
argued- beyond the fact that he was justa child- taht he had little
choice if he wanted to save Yemi.

[tdciago]

Post by J***@webtv.net
EKO [helping Michael clean the blood]: For a brief time I served in a
small parish in England. Every Sunday after Mass, I would see a young
boy waiting in the back of the church. And then one day, the boy
confessed to me that he had beaten his dog to death with a shovel. He
said that the dog had bitten his baby sister on the cheek; and he needed
to protect her. And he wanted to know whether he would go to hell for
this. I told him that God would understand -- that he would be forgiven,
as long as he was sorry. But the boy did not care about forgiveness. He
was only afraid that if he did go to hell -- that dog would be there
waiting for him.

...

Yes, just replace "sister" with "brother," and this is a description of
Eko himself, and what eventually happened to him. He wanted to protect
his brother, he killed the criminal "dogs," he didn't care about
forgiveness, and Cerberus was waiting for him.